Photography For Real Estate

21 Responses to “My Formula For Pricing Real Estate Photography”

• Real Estate/Buisness News » Blog Archive » My Formula For Pricing Real Estate Photography April 5th, 2008 at 3:33 pm #

  [...] Original post by larry [...]

• Scott Pruett April 5th, 2008 at 8:18 pm #

  It’s a little obscure, but I suppose I see your logic. If the numbers fit within your cost of doing business calculations, then sure, go for it.

• Linda Sabiston April 5th, 2008 at 9:07 pm #

  Interesting theory. I’ll investigate my local area and see what numbers I come up with.
  But, I like to round up instead of down.

• Dale Charles April 6th, 2008 at 9:12 am #

  I was just doing the same thing this week! I usually charge a flat rate and work with many different Realtors at many levels - but I though I’d try something different as I do hear some clients moan about how much they spend on marketing (as I meet them in their new BMW’s) so I thought I’d use the “Average Realtors Commission” (ARC) as a starting point.
  I find your comparison…interesting. I’m aiming a little higher but I understand your thinking, a lot. I use to use the “carpenter comparison” as I was a carpenter for 3 years - most guys make around $300/day, the hacks, less. Painters price about $200/room with materials, and anybody can paint a wall. Plumbers get $90/hr, more or less and I know some rich plumbers!

  I usually price around $250 for anything given my current equipment and lighting (and my tripod just took it’s “last stand..”), and a website is $100-150 more.

  Here’s my new pricing-theory math:

  Home price - $500,000
  Realtors Commission - 6 % or $30,000
  1% of Realtors Commission - $300
  .05% of ARC - $150

  I just shot a $1.7M 5000′ for a new client and I want her business as she works in a really upscale neighborhood. I charged her $295 for 24 photos and I’m giving her a website to look at for a month. That should have been $510 for photography only at 1% of her 3% gross commission - I assume its 3% rather than 6% at $1.7M?

  Six percent of $1.7M is $102,000..seems a lot, I wouldn’t pay that as a seller, but I simply do not know where the break is, I mean 6% of a $5M house is $300,000 and if I’m shooting that I want $1-2000 for AD quality photos, for sure.

  The average sub $1M prop Realtor takes home what, about 65-75% after marketing costs, expenses, fees, taxes? Larry what does your Realtor wife charge for a commission for $1M and up props?

  * That would be a great thread / chart - what Realtors actually spend and earn with a list-item of all expenses! Anyone???

  Dale Charles
  compago.net

• fred danziger April 6th, 2008 at 10:49 am #

  hi dale, what state and city do you live/work?

• fred danziger April 6th, 2008 at 10:51 am #

  hi dale, what state and city do you live/work?
  i think that might play a role in your fees

• larry April 6th, 2008 at 10:52 am #

  @Dale - It’s virtually impossible these days to generalize about how much Realtor commissions are. The standard until the last few years was the seller payed a total of 6% to sell their home. 3% went to the buyer’s agent and 3% went to the listing agent. Because 3% becomes so obscene as the sale price gets over $1M the commissions have always been more negotiable with higher-end listings.

  In the last few years commissions have become much more negotiable. Some agents do it for 1% some for 2% what ever they choose. It’s totally negotiable between the agent and the seller. The large brokers try to discourage discounting but in fact they don’t stop it. Companies like zillow.com and redfin.com are putting pressure on Realtors commissions (at least in the NW and I think it’s happening all over).

  For these reasons, I don’t think it makes sense to try to base photography prices on the listing agents commissions.

• Scott April 6th, 2008 at 10:54 am #

  Larry, I love that formula. I’ll look into it in this area and see if it holds up!

  @ Dale — the trouble with your approach is that no realtor I’ve ever met or heard of gets a 6% commission. At best, the 6% is split between the selling agent and the buyer’s agent, and that’s before any discounting takes place, which in the current highly competitive market is happening more and more, I think. So figure on something between 2% - 3% as the upper end of the gross for the agents. Still a considerable sum, but you also have to remember that they may or may not get anything at all, depending on whether they can actually sell the place before the listing agreement expires - again a common experience in this market.

• Dale Charles April 6th, 2008 at 11:33 am #

  Fred - I work from Sacramento to San Francisco…

  Thanks for the heads up Larry. Luckily my approach is NOT the 1% of 6% theory I was crunching this week, as I wrote before I always charge $2-300 for any $500K-1M listing.

  Strangely I advertise “Photography starts at $65..” on my website and no-one asks for that rate, I am finding many average Realtors sadly have Rebel Xti’s or D40’s and just go take snapshots so I really dont bother with them anymore although I’ll shoot any prop if I’m not busy!

  It doesn’t matter what the Realtors commission is, my rates will always vary as I never turn down work. I always negotiate anyways to get the client at any level. I tried the “First shoot free” approach someone wrote about on this board a while back and I did not get one taker!

  A month ago I drove 102 miles for a cheapo shoot but got to drive through some Norcal vineyards so the experience was righteous, and the cheapo Realtor keeps giving me work. Plus the client’s house was cool, and an interesting person for sure.

  Question - what’s the best tripod under $300???

• Dale Charles April 6th, 2008 at 11:56 am #

  Scott Hargis -

  really like your strobism…do you use any diffusers on your Flashes - or umbrellas? How long does it take for you to set up 5 Flashes and get the right placement?

  Thanks for the inspiration.

• Ken Hawkins April 6th, 2008 at 2:02 pm #

  Hi Larry,
  I’m learning so much from your blog and your talented contributors but I had to check the date of your post twice to see if it was dated April 1st. I’ve heard a lot of pricing strategies over my 38 years in photojournalism…but I’ve never even considered your furnace repair schema.
  Let me suggest - humbly as a newcomer to REP - that there are several options that may assist any photographer in determining a baseline Cost of Doing Business (CoDB).
  One of my professional associations , NPPA- The National Press Photographers Association, has a CoDB calculator that can be found at http://nppa.org/professional_development/business_practices/cdb/cdbcalc.cfm (You may have to copy and paste the link into your browser url window).
  This interactive asset may give the REP a good idea of the financial realities that impact us all no matter which specialty you work in.
  Thanks again for your efforts Larry…now I gotta go check my furnace filter…

  Ken Hawkins
  http://www.kenhawkins.com

• Gar April 6th, 2008 at 8:05 pm #

  @Dale,

  I have a Bogen Manfrotto 3021N Tripod ($175) and a Manfrotto Pan & Tilt HD Blk Head ($60) and I love it. They have all different kinds of heads for that tripod. It is sturdy, light (relative) easy to use and easy and fast to adjust. They have a newer version of the same tripod that allows you to take the center adjustment pole and remove it and use it horizontally, kool. Not sure of the model number but if you go to the Bogen site you can most likely find it.

  @Larry,

  I too will take a look at that pricing scenario in my area. Interesting concept.

  Cheers!
  Gar

• David Davis April 7th, 2008 at 4:19 am #

  I am a realtor in Utah. I’d like to clarify some things about commissions. First, 6 percent is the standard amount a seller would pay to sell their home. However, as has been said earlier, that is split between the seller’s agent and the buyer’s agent 50/50. But this is not the end. The broker for the agent often gets a cut of that. For example: at Prudential I currently get 80 percent of the three percent, and from that I pay a transaction coordinator and for marketing materials bringing my net income to about 78 percent. So, on a 500K home my broker gets $15K and at 80 percent I would net $12K before my expenses.

  As for calculating what to charge for a photo shoot, I would compare what Obeo or Circle Pix charges and go from there (keep in mind these rank amatuers are the “in and out” types that will finish a job without extra lighting in about 30 minutes - and it shows in their work). I’ve also used the per square foot formula but have since adopted a basic shoot cost around the $200 to $300 range depending on the distance I have to travel for the shoot. Usually I’m only shooting main living areas; foyer, livingroom, family room, kitchen/dining room, and master bedroom at different angles. I’ll throw in the theater room if they have one. Using this formula, it doesn’t matter how big or little the home is. The seller/agent gets these main living areas for a set price. I add on pole mounted aerials, twilight shots of the exterior, and may include some general neighborhood features (parks, etc.). All this being said, if you were to schedule one photo shoot per day for five days each week at $250 (average), you’re making a mere $65,250. But, that’s not a bad income for doing something you love to do. Lastly, check out ActiveRain.com and search photography. I was impressed to find some talent over there and some insight on shooting exteriors; look for a fellow in Texas - his name I think is Clark Coots. Here is a shameless plug: if you decide you’d like to join AR, please mention me as the referral source; iPhotoHomes.
  Thanks for this wonderful blog and great community.

• 360House April 7th, 2008 at 12:48 pm #

  “I would compare what Obeo or Circle Pix charges and go from there (keep in mind these rank amatuers are the “in and out” types that will finish a job without extra lighting in about 30 minutes - and it shows in their work).”

  Hey! I resemble that!!!

  No, really — it doesn’t make sense for me to put a ton of time into shooting a tour, because I’m only making around $35 per house. (drive time + shooting + post-processing + uploading = underpaid @ $35 per house)

  Nice thing is, I’m usually shooting 4-6 homes per day.

• Chester Bullock April 8th, 2008 at 10:54 am #

  @360House,

  Given your statement of 4-6 houses per day at $35/ house, I am assuming a constant average of 5 houses per day. 5 days a week, 52 weeks a year, that comes to $45,500/ year. After taxes and such, that hardly seems a fitting income for all the time you are putting in…

• 360House April 8th, 2008 at 12:12 pm #

  Chester

  I get to work from home, shoot only 3-4 hours per day, post-process for only 1-2 hours per day, and the best part is that someone else is doing the selling, marketing and website maintenance for me.

  Getting a repeat base of customers on my own in a market that is owned by Circlepix/obeo would be difficult.

  Your estimate for my yearly pay is high, but I’m not looking to get rich doing this. I’ll take this instead of sitting in an office 40+ hrs per week, thankyouverymuch.

• Lee April 14th, 2008 at 11:10 am #

  You really need to charge what you are worth and not base it on what someone else is getting paid for a totally different service. Photographers starting out will find it difficult to command the type of money a seasoned photographer gets. This is not only because of the skill and quality of the product the seasoned photographer produces, but you must also factor in the client base they have built up over time.
  As a REALTOR, I won’t pay a photographer 1% of my gross proceeds if I can get acceptable product for less. On the other hand, if it costs me more than 1% of my gross proceeds to get the quality photographs that will get the house sold, then I must pay up. I don’t get paid until the home sells.
  Once you prove your worth to me, it will be difficult for me to take a chance on the next photographer who offers me the same service for less. At this point, you have become the seasoned photographer.

• larry April 14th, 2008 at 11:35 am #

  @Lee - You raise good points. As much as anything my pricing formula is intended to help real estate photographers find a lower bound for their pricing. I know photographers that are charging $100 to photograph the same home that it costs $130 to get the furnace maintained. This means that photographers are loosing money big time!

• Bob Copp January 11th, 2009 at 5:40 am #

  I think this is sound rationale to use to calculate travel and labor costs. But why would you use a 1.7 multiplier when you say you are going to put in 4 times as much work as the furnace guy (2 hours vs. 30 minutes)? Sure, the travel is the same, but this multiplier does not consider the differing marketing time requirements (phone book for the furnace guy, personal visits, discussions, delivery of material, and picking out shots with the real estate person or homeowner/client) or post-shoot presentation work, including post processing, for the photographer. So far, I do very little real estate photography but I charge $300 for a three hour, three outfit portrait shoot, done at my studio (no travel, no dragging equipment, no resulting extra wear and tear on my equipment and no need of a special vehicle, such as a van). All prints, books, retouching, etc. are added to this price. And these usually do not generate income for anyone but me — for instance, they are not the driving force for a commission of thousands of dollars like good real estate photography can be! I have never charged less than $500 for a finished set of prop shots. It is the same as portraiture to me: if it is not worth that, or for very inexpensive homes (are there any?) then go for it with your RebelXt. But it won’t look anything like what I do. As the great John Todman said, “You get what you pay for and often substantially less.”

• Patrick Robinson February 23rd, 2009 at 11:32 am #

  I would usually charge like this.
  I specialize in wedding photography and I charge $150-$200 an hour. With Real Estate I charge half of my hourly rate which is roughly $75 an hour because I don’t have to deal with a bunch of annoying people. It’s just me and the peacefulness of the House. That 75 is for my pocket. I then charge $5 per room and another $75.00 for editing and all the images on CD; hi-res and web images. So for a basic 3 bed 2 bath, kitchen, living, dining, formal living and dining and the exterior front and rear of the House would be at roughly $210.00

• Rebel with a Cause April 14th, 2009 at 4:39 pm #

  I thought I would throw out my pricing structure and get some feedback. I have two basic “packages” that I offer: one is photography only - I charge $50/hr shooting and anywhere from $75-150 for post-production prints on CD (price increases with homes list price).

  The second package includes a bit more - I do the photography, design a postcard/flier layout (normally MUCH more appealing than what they usually get - i’m a graphic designer at heart), and include 100 prints on 100lb glossy paper (I have a way of getting prints for cheaper than most do so a good chunk of profit comes from this). I charge $1 for each print over that 100. For this I charge anywhere from $250 to to $500 depending on list price. They can buy the prints on CD for an additional $50 as well.

  Thats basically it. I have found packaging the three services together for a pretty cheap price works great. Any input or advice???